Marketing guru Scott Mann shares his thoughts on running a “collective” agency model, lead generation, social media automation, the current state of branding, and gives advice to those who are changing careers and entering the field of marketing for the first time.
Otis Kopp: I am here with Scott Mann, CEO of Highforge Directive in Orlando, Florida. Scott is a seasoned marketing professional who has transitioned from running Highforge as a marketing freelancer, to a full-out agency with over 20 employees, and has now pivoted his business model to what he calls a “collective,” partnering with other agencies and freelancers. He’s an Emmy Award winning creative director, and has been a certified Google Ads expert for almost two decades. Scott is also a business coach, a consultant, a well sought-after speaker, a motivator, and is an active leader in the WordPress community. Scott, thank you for taking the time out of your busy schedule to meet with us today.
Scott Mann: My pleasure. Hopefully, I can live up to all those crazy words.
Otis: Well, your resume speaks for itself. As I mentioned in the introduction, you currently follow a new business model that you have deemed a collective. Can you explain a little about what a collective agency consists of, and how the shift from a more traditional agency has affected the way that you now do business?
Scott: Yeah, probably the best way to kind of visualize the new model is kind of like a jellyfish colony. Each jellyfish is its own entity, but they all kind of move together in unison as they travel from place to place. The way that I do business is actually very similar. As far as our clients are concerned, their view of the work that we’re doing and how we’re doing it is very similar. The only exception is, occasionally we name another company or another freelancer. They might not have the same email address or domain name as us. But aside from that, the reality is, when you’re running a small agency, if you have less than 60 employees, you’re kind of required to have your entire team be generalists. When clients come to you with problems, you have to throw the problem to your team whether they’re qualified to handle the problem or not. And they have to figure it out and solve the problem, which forces them all to be generalists. They have to wear a lot of different hats. And, in reality, the way that plays out is, that’s not the best solution for clients.
The reality is, a specialist who’s really, really good at one thing can do that one thing so much faster and with such less effort and produce better results. There is magic in specialties. By allowing our collective to expand away from 20 employees to now 60 different strategic partners, with no overhead attached to that, has allowed us to put specialists on client projects whenever and wherever needed, and produce much better results at a better price-point in many cases, as well. So overall, for the way that I lead a business, this model has worked much better and is far more effective, both for my mental health and my clients’ mental health. The results benefit everybody involved, even the vendors and specialists that we work with.
Otis: Now, I know that you started this model before the pandemic hit. However, it seems ideal for the current climate that the Covid-19 crisis has created. How has the pandemic, and the necessity to work remotely, affected marketing agencies like Highforge?
Scott: Well, in our case, it didn’t affect us very much as an agency in terms of operations. Obviously, we had already moved to completely remote work. But what I have noticed, and this is huge, is that most traditional businesses got a wake-up call when this happened. A shocking amount of new business started coming the way of digital marketing agencies within a couple of months of the pandemic hitting, because their entire business model was turned upside down. Most of these older traditional businesses were reliant almost completely on their physical sales force, people going out to events and networking and meeting with clients in person and knocking on doors. And immediately, overnight, all of that was shut down and they had to find a new way if they wanted to continue to exist. And the only way for them to continue to exist was to find ways to get sales and get leads without physical contact, and that led them all to start hiring digital agencies left and right.
Otis: Interesting. Well, it seems like you’re a pioneer in that area. Now when it comes to leads, one area that many marketers I know struggle with is maintaining a consistent stream of clients. What do you believe is the most effective way a marketer can generate and nurture their leads?
Scott: Oh, there are a lot of different channels out there. It isn’t that one way is more effective than others, but it really depends on where the business is in its maturity. A freelancer just starting out is going to use a combination of digital and physical. I would recommend a combination of digital and physical initiatives. And really, in this scenario, all I can do is talk to what has worked for our agency. I would say that we were getting a decent amount of business from word-of-mouth. Initially the focus was, right out of the gate, without having a single client, to get client number one. It was calling all of my friends and family, everybody I knew, my extended network. If they knew anybody who was running a business, if I thought they might have a parent that was running a business, if a friend of a friend was running a business, anybody, anybody I knew that might be doing something. I was calling people I knew and asking, “Hey, do you know anybody who needs help with this? Hey, do you know anybody that needs help with that?” It was really a grassroots effort to get client number one. And then, after closing business with client number one, then that client recommended us to somebody else.
And we got client number two and client number two recommended us to two or three other people. And that’s how we got clients, three through five. But eventually that is going to run out. People are going to run out of people to refer to in a local market. And it’s usually physically connected local markets that are making those word-of-mouth referrals. And those markets can only take you so far. So after that, then it’s: now how do we find some business online? Try running some ads on various channels. Right now, running videos on social media is one way to connect. But I would actually say the most effective way for freelancers to get new business is in-person networking, which means showing up to all the meet-ups, going to the WordPress events, going to places like BNI, which are in every city in the country and, in fact, probably in almost every country in the world. Those are free to attend, and are full of business owners and other people that can refer business.
It’s really a matter of choosing channels to test. Test those channels, and find out what’s working and what’s not. Spend as much time in that channel-testing as you need, to find out whether it’s going to work. And if it’s not producing results, move to the next channel. If one is producing results, put more effort into that channel. It’s really kind of like fishing, which is marketing in general. You go to a pond and you’re like, “I wonder if there are fish in this pond?” You take your bamboo pole and you put a plastic worm on it and you stick it in the pond. And, if nothing happens, you move on to the next pond. If something starts hitting on that plastic worm, you’re like, “Oh, well, something might be here.” And then you go get a real worm and you try that, and you pull up a fish. “Okay, let’s go get a bigger pole.” And you keep fishing. If you’re pulling up bigger and bigger fish, “Okay, let’s go buy a boat.” That’s the process.
Otis: That was a great analogy. I really enjoyed that. Brian Carroll, a fellow marketer, once said that the more we’re able to effectively automate, the more that we can provide a human touch to our services. What automation tools would you suggest for social media management?
Scott: Yeah, there are literally tons of tools out there. And it really depends on how much of your business is going to be related to social media. There are very simple ones that are not particularly expensive, like Buffer and HootSuite. Those are probably the top two. If your business is going to be related to managing client social media as well, then you might level up. There are some other tools like Buffer and HootSuite. I’m trying to remember, it’s not jumping to the top of my head. It’s got a leaf in the title. I think Sprout. That’s what it is. SproutSocial. They have a leaf in the logo. So SproutSocial is kind of like Buffer and HootSuite on steroids. But, essentially, all these tools allow you to log in to five or ten different accounts simultaneously, write one piece of content, make minor adjustments to it based on the platform, click send, and it distributes across all platforms in one click. So it’s not fully automated. I mean, obviously someone still has to write content. There’s no automation for producing content out of thin air. However, a lot of work can be done very quickly by sourcing other people’s content, and then distributing through using these tools.
Otis: Appreciate the advice. I know a few people who use HootSuite and swear by it. Now let’s shift to branding, which I know is one of your areas of expertise. How do you believe that the concept of branding has changed in the last five years?
Scott: Well, it’s not that it’s changed. I just think that the reality is, branding is, the same animal as it was one hundred years ago. But what’s important for people to realize about branding is this: branding is not just a logo. Branding is not just the colors of the company. Branding is now. The best way to think about it is as a human being. And one of my favorite quotes on branding is: the results of your branding can be found in what people are saying behind the company’s back about that company. And when you think about it that way, it really is a person. Treating a company as if it’s a person, and giving it a story, giving it a face, giving it a voice. All of these components are essential parts of a brand. And thinking about the brand from the point of it being an actual person will give brand marketers and companies a path to follow. So a logo and colors might be the face of the brand, but the tone of voice and the personality that’s used when writing the content for the brand, that’s the voice of the person, right? So now we have a face and a voice. Those are all components that make up a brand. And so thinking about a brand from that level of perception is going to lead to positive results. And if you think of a brand as anything less than that, you’re missing an opportunity.
Otis: I love the concept of personalizing your brand. I think a lot of the viewers will find that helpful. What advice would you give to people who are trying to change careers and enter into the marketing world?
Scott: Well, there are a lot of directions that you can go here, but the reality is, everything that you need to learn is available on Google. And school is really, really helpful for finding peers and for networking and creating experiences. One of the things that I wish somebody had told me when I was in college is that college wasn’t necessarily just to learn, learn from books. The purpose is to connect you with the people that you might spend your future working with, and to create experiences with those people. It is more about the people than what you’re learning in the class, in many cases. So, when jumping into a career fresh, there are really kind of two paths. Well, technically, three. So we’ll talk about those three paths. One is to go work for a company, and doing marketing for that company, whether it’s taking an internship position or taking a junior position in a marketing or sales department. Another one would be to join an agency, which is jumping into the deep end. And agency work means that you’re probably going to drink from a fire hose, and go in a lot of different directions. And you’re going to need tough skin, because you’re going to make a lot of mistakes in the beginning of your career. And mistakes, I want to say, are really important. It is really, really important that you make those mistakes. Do not be afraid to make those mistakes, because those mistakes are how you get better. Fear is your enemy. Mistakes are your friends.
And then, the third path is to go the freelancer route. Which is to start calling everybody you know, and start going to all the networking events. And in that scenario, if you’re going the freelancer route, you’re also going to need to learn more skills than just marketing. You’re going to need to learn banking and finance. You’re going to need to learn how to set up a bank account. You’re going to have to file for a fictitious name, or get incorporated, form an LLC. Then you’re going to need to have a separate bank account for your freelancer business. And then, you’re going to have to take out twenty-five to thirty percent of every check you ever make and put that in a second business bank account to pay your taxes. You’re going to have to learn a lot of other things as a freelancer. But the trade-off is, you get to set your own schedule, you get to determine where you work, you get to set your own parameters. It’s a double-edged sword, because you can also work one hundred hours a week. And because you’re working for yourself, you’re oftentimes not paying yourself for one hundred hours a week. So it’s a matter of finding your own balance, determining where your energy is leading you. And if you’re not sure, test out all three of those paths. You know, give yourself six months in one, give yourself six months in another, give yourself six months in another to find out where you feel most comfortable moving forward. Or maybe even better, where you find yourself most uncomfortable, because that’s the place where you’re going to learn and grow the most.
Otis: Well, Scott, thank you for your time. It has been an honor to speak with you today. Now, if you don’t mind, please let the viewers know a little bit more about what you’re up to these days, your contact information, and about the services that you provide at Highforge.
Scott: Yeah, I mean, we’re always looking for specialists. If there’s somebody really, really good at one specific thing, or has a really deep knowledge of a specific industry, we’re always open to talk, because if we get a client who has a specific need, oftentimes there’s an ability for us to connect. And we work with small mom-and-pop shops, all the way up to enterprise-level companies. And that’s actually one of the beautiful things about this model. A traditional agency with 20 people—it costs a lot of money to turn the keys on that car to get it going. And so we couldn’t work with small businesses when we were in that older model. In this new model, we can be working with junior freelancers and people who are early in their careers, and connect them with small businesses who don’t have big budgets sometimes. So sometimes that’s a good fit. So there’s an opportunity there.
And yeah, thanks for having me, Otis. You and your friends that I’ve also met at the WordCamp events, you guys are doing some good stuff. You’re learning and you’re growing and I suspect you’re going to get to where I’m at a lot faster than I did. So I wish you the best of luck.
Special thanks to Scott Mann and Highforge Solutions
@CScottMann (Twitter)
www.Highforge.com
About the Author:
OTIS KOPP
LinkedIn: @OtisKopp
Twitter: @OtisKopp617
OtisKopp.com
OtisKopp@gmail.com